Electrically they are the same thing. They are directly connected together.Not sure why they went straight to battery from the alternator and not to the starter relay as per the MAD upgrade?
Voltage question......
Moderator: Moderators
Cheers Dave.Dave wrote:Well judging by the amount of corrosion and dirt I can see in your photos there is a chance the voltage regulator was not grounded to the bodywork very well. So that may be your issue. Like I said in my first post, make sure the body of the voltage regulator has a good connection to ground (and the -ve terminal of the battery) otherwise it will not work.
I will clean up both VR's and the mounting location first. Then test and see what i'm getting at the battery again!
Any idea on the colour connectors on the Voltage regulators being different.......any significance?
Dave Tildesley.....MMA-081
72 Dodge Dart
73 Plymouth Duster - SOLD
I wanna go so FAST i think i'm going to DIE!..........Then i'll shift into second!
"My Car is a work in progress, Probably never gonna get finished, never gonna have the money to Bananarama!!"
72 Dodge Dart
73 Plymouth Duster - SOLD
I wanna go so FAST i think i'm going to DIE!..........Then i'll shift into second!
"My Car is a work in progress, Probably never gonna get finished, never gonna have the money to Bananarama!!"
I would redo it Dave....everything you need is in the thread. Run nice new wiring and clean all the treminals to the quality you did your dash. I know I harp on about it but I would run a seperate earth for the regulator to the bulkhead. Just get a piece of the wire you use for the bypass and stick a couple of ring terminals on each end. Put the ring between the mounting bolt and a star washer then through the mounting hole and tighten. Drill a small hole in the bulkhead and clean to bare metal around it. Self taper, other end of lead, then star washer and screw into bulkhead. Job done. Also make sure the metal on the bulkhead where the VR touches is bare metal.
I have a VR you can have Dave and why dont you go the whole hog and fit the HEI you have.....do it all as one project
I have a VR you can have Dave and why dont you go the whole hog and fit the HEI you have.....do it all as one project
Bat Girl Stalker Living Petes Dream
Hey guys,
Put the Silver (black backed) VR on tonight. Cleaned both the mounting face and the mounting location back down to bare metal.
I'm still only getting around 12.3-12.5v at idle.
Maintaining high revs it peaked at about 15.2v but seemed to hang at 15v for the majority.
It got nowhere near the 16-17 i had before, so think that hopefully the new VR is showing that its working. But, most forums plus here say 14.7v as does the info on this VR i found online. How is it hitting 15.2v and will it kill the VR?
Also how do i test the alternator?
I put the multimeter on the bat post on the alternator and used the negative poston the battery to complete the circuit............At idle it was showing 11.9v......?
Have got new wire for Alternator to starter relay and starter relay to battery which i will fit tomorrow and see if new wiring helps..........Just want to check the Alternator is not buggered first!
Put the Silver (black backed) VR on tonight. Cleaned both the mounting face and the mounting location back down to bare metal.
I'm still only getting around 12.3-12.5v at idle.
Maintaining high revs it peaked at about 15.2v but seemed to hang at 15v for the majority.
It got nowhere near the 16-17 i had before, so think that hopefully the new VR is showing that its working. But, most forums plus here say 14.7v as does the info on this VR i found online. How is it hitting 15.2v and will it kill the VR?
Also how do i test the alternator?
I put the multimeter on the bat post on the alternator and used the negative poston the battery to complete the circuit............At idle it was showing 11.9v......?
Have got new wire for Alternator to starter relay and starter relay to battery which i will fit tomorrow and see if new wiring helps..........Just want to check the Alternator is not buggered first!
Dave Tildesley.....MMA-081
72 Dodge Dart
73 Plymouth Duster - SOLD
I wanna go so FAST i think i'm going to DIE!..........Then i'll shift into second!
"My Car is a work in progress, Probably never gonna get finished, never gonna have the money to Bananarama!!"
72 Dodge Dart
73 Plymouth Duster - SOLD
I wanna go so FAST i think i'm going to DIE!..........Then i'll shift into second!
"My Car is a work in progress, Probably never gonna get finished, never gonna have the money to Bananarama!!"
One goes to the ignition, the other is ground (I think).Dave wrote:Colour is neither here no there. It's what is connected to each end that counts.Dave81 wrote: Any idea on the colour connectors on the Voltage regulators being different.......any significance?
You can put a 12v reader on the cable and with the ignition on/off you can see 0/12v
|| '68 Dodge Dart || '70 Plymouth Satellite || '72 Mk1 Escort || '98 AMG E55 || '85 2CV || S1 106 Rallye || E36 || E46 ||
your igntion is doing what they all do after 40+ years
all that stuff oozes out
as it was there only to stop you seeing what was in the box and to assist with avoidance of broken circuit due to vibration or water ingress loosing it doesn't mean your igntion won't work
you just have slightly higher potential for bad circuit due to vibration and water.
On the alternator wire
direct to battery or direct to the stud on the starter relay is the same thing bar a length of cable
orginally it would have gone there via an ammeter in the dash
makes no odds
the alternator flows current into the circuit via the link to the battery
the voltage regulator tests what the battery state is
and switches on the alternator more or less to recitify the un charged-ness i thinks its seeing
it does this by comparing what it finds in comparison to Earth which it sees through its metal case via the chassis back to the neagtive of the battery
if it thinks earth is a few volts above battery - level then thats what gets added to its decision to charge the battery
i.e if there is a poor earth between regulator and the chassis
it sees the 15 or 16 volts its causing the alternator to produce as 14.3 volts. poor earth of regulator is like dirty glasses....it can't see properly so it over does it to Make sure
spikey washers both sides of one of the mountings clean the chasis around the screw hole and cover in normal weheel bearing grease
bolt up regulator nice and tight so as to really grind the spikey washers into the bodywork
clean up any mess
then
do the same with
1) the engine end of earth strap
2) body end of earth strap
3) if your battery terminals are bolted to the ends of the fat leads take them off. cut back insulatioin to clean copper cut off the horrible green ends and bolt your battery connectors back onto their shiny as new leads with a smear of grease in each
grease the terminals on the battery with vasaline.
if things still no better go through your fuse box cleaning every fuse end and holder
go through all the connections in the back. clean reclamp the spades with plyers and reconnect
do the same at the igntion switch junction block
life should then be good..... this is a bit of work that allthough is an onerous pain in the ass you will notice a seat of the pants improvement in performance....
nothing wrong with old wires if the insulatio n is still good. but old connectors and connections to chassis cause issues. clean em and reap the benefits of not rewiring your car when you really don't need to.
job done good for another 40 years
Dave
dave
all that stuff oozes out
as it was there only to stop you seeing what was in the box and to assist with avoidance of broken circuit due to vibration or water ingress loosing it doesn't mean your igntion won't work
you just have slightly higher potential for bad circuit due to vibration and water.
On the alternator wire
direct to battery or direct to the stud on the starter relay is the same thing bar a length of cable
orginally it would have gone there via an ammeter in the dash
makes no odds
the alternator flows current into the circuit via the link to the battery
the voltage regulator tests what the battery state is
and switches on the alternator more or less to recitify the un charged-ness i thinks its seeing
it does this by comparing what it finds in comparison to Earth which it sees through its metal case via the chassis back to the neagtive of the battery
if it thinks earth is a few volts above battery - level then thats what gets added to its decision to charge the battery
i.e if there is a poor earth between regulator and the chassis
it sees the 15 or 16 volts its causing the alternator to produce as 14.3 volts. poor earth of regulator is like dirty glasses....it can't see properly so it over does it to Make sure
spikey washers both sides of one of the mountings clean the chasis around the screw hole and cover in normal weheel bearing grease
bolt up regulator nice and tight so as to really grind the spikey washers into the bodywork
clean up any mess
then
do the same with
1) the engine end of earth strap
2) body end of earth strap
3) if your battery terminals are bolted to the ends of the fat leads take them off. cut back insulatioin to clean copper cut off the horrible green ends and bolt your battery connectors back onto their shiny as new leads with a smear of grease in each
grease the terminals on the battery with vasaline.
if things still no better go through your fuse box cleaning every fuse end and holder
go through all the connections in the back. clean reclamp the spades with plyers and reconnect
do the same at the igntion switch junction block
life should then be good..... this is a bit of work that allthough is an onerous pain in the ass you will notice a seat of the pants improvement in performance....
nothing wrong with old wires if the insulatio n is still good. but old connectors and connections to chassis cause issues. clean em and reap the benefits of not rewiring your car when you really don't need to.
job done good for another 40 years
Dave
dave
The Greater Knapweed near the Mugwort by the Buckthorn tree is dying
Cheers Dave,
We'll rewired the Alt to starter relay and starter relay to battery with new stuff. New battery connectors on positive and negative side. Replaced VR with the silver one and bare metalled all connection for a good earth!
No difference!
Put the engine under load and it'Bananarama! 15.9 max at what I would consider driving rpm........too much for me.
Adjusted idle up a bit and got it at 13.5v when warm, but still seeing the 15.8 as you would expect.
Tested alternator battery connection and earthed using alternator casing........11.9v.......must be the issue.
So new alternator time, got one coming tomorrow........
If I still have the issue I will rewire the rest using the whole MAD rewire.......not something I wanted to do this side of a total stripdown/NATS.
Q. When I redid the dash a few weeks ago I noticed that the alt gauge had not been bypassed........Would this be the possible cause?
All that I have read is that these are weak spots and would result in no/minimal charging of the system.......not overcharging like I am getting!
Anyway........After that if it's still playing up I'll sit in a dark corner and drink!
We'll rewired the Alt to starter relay and starter relay to battery with new stuff. New battery connectors on positive and negative side. Replaced VR with the silver one and bare metalled all connection for a good earth!
No difference!
Put the engine under load and it'Bananarama! 15.9 max at what I would consider driving rpm........too much for me.
Adjusted idle up a bit and got it at 13.5v when warm, but still seeing the 15.8 as you would expect.
Tested alternator battery connection and earthed using alternator casing........11.9v.......must be the issue.
So new alternator time, got one coming tomorrow........
If I still have the issue I will rewire the rest using the whole MAD rewire.......not something I wanted to do this side of a total stripdown/NATS.
Q. When I redid the dash a few weeks ago I noticed that the alt gauge had not been bypassed........Would this be the possible cause?
All that I have read is that these are weak spots and would result in no/minimal charging of the system.......not overcharging like I am getting!
Anyway........After that if it's still playing up I'll sit in a dark corner and drink!
Dave Tildesley.....MMA-081
72 Dodge Dart
73 Plymouth Duster - SOLD
I wanna go so FAST i think i'm going to DIE!..........Then i'll shift into second!
"My Car is a work in progress, Probably never gonna get finished, never gonna have the money to Bananarama!!"
72 Dodge Dart
73 Plymouth Duster - SOLD
I wanna go so FAST i think i'm going to DIE!..........Then i'll shift into second!
"My Car is a work in progress, Probably never gonna get finished, never gonna have the money to Bananarama!!"
Hey Sinny its a dual field as shown in your diagram.sinny wrote:Check you've got it wired as per the below picture. How many field wires has your alternator got?
Date stamped 74.
Will trace the wiring and see what i've got..........
Dave Tildesley.....MMA-081
72 Dodge Dart
73 Plymouth Duster - SOLD
I wanna go so FAST i think i'm going to DIE!..........Then i'll shift into second!
"My Car is a work in progress, Probably never gonna get finished, never gonna have the money to Bananarama!!"
72 Dodge Dart
73 Plymouth Duster - SOLD
I wanna go so FAST i think i'm going to DIE!..........Then i'll shift into second!
"My Car is a work in progress, Probably never gonna get finished, never gonna have the money to Bananarama!!"
Dave81 wrote:Cheers Dave,
Tested alternator battery connection and earthed using alternator casing........11.9v.......must be the issue.
Q. When I redid the dash a few weeks ago I noticed that the alt gauge had not been bypassed........Would this be the possible cause?
!
what did you test above?
alternator casing is at 11.9 volts when ruinning?
or you checked between the to-battery stud and earth when it was running and only got 11.9?
if it wasn't running i'd expect that. you are just seeing battery voltage
the ammeter bit is a red herring don't worry about that current takes route of least resistance
Dave
The Greater Knapweed near the Mugwort by the Buckthorn tree is dying