starter motor

Mopar related chat and bench racing

Moderator: Moderators

Post Reply
rogthedodge
Posts: 217
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 05 9:41 pm
Location: bexleyheath kent

starter motor

Post by rogthedodge »

anyone watch Garage squad last night?They had problems with starter/header interference on a '70 big block Charger.The mechanic said a '92 Dakota starter is a direct replacement part.Anyone heard of this/done it?
do it in a dodge
three counties
Posts: 153
Joined: Mon Oct 11, 04 9:17 pm
Location: linton,cambridge

Re: starter motor

Post by three counties »

have never heard of that,but i did watch the program,did like the 70 charger
User avatar
Pete
Posts: 21944
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 04 10:49 pm
Location: MMA Chairman

Re: starter motor

Post by Pete »

Yes, a lot of them nearly fit, but do not tend to last long.

Make sure it is a perfect fit, or you will damage the ring gear on the Convertor....
Pete Wiseman; Cambridge.

Mopar by the grace of God
User avatar
Dave999
Posts: 9427
Joined: Thu Feb 24, 05 10:31 am
Location: Twickenham,London, England

Re: starter motor

Post by Dave999 »

Dodge dakota starter is a denso 1.4kw made by denso or licenced production by anyone who would, when chrysler asked i,e you can find bosch labeled versions

same starter as the starters sold as mopar hi torque mini starters, although the sellers of them may well rebuild with higher spec or custom parts i guess.....naaa probably not...who are we kidding they just say MOPAR + 50% on the price

the mounting holes same as original starter
the nose with the spigot for the bellhousing is the same as the original starter
the clocking of the connector and solenoid is different in some cases but the things are so damn small in relation to the original the worst you might have to do is make a little clearance some where. you end up with the solenoid and connector closer to the block and the motor further away
it should have a 32mm 10 tooth pinion with pinion at rest measurement of 24mm
which is the same as the original starter

most of the expensive HI TORQUE starters sold for mopars are this starter with this pinion and the intermediate plate changed to a custom one to allow you to clock the starter over slightly to get easier access to where the wires go on they don't come with the snout which makes no difference to operation as it doesn't support the shaft anyway, no problem when its bolted to a cast iron bellhousing.

If you use a steel scatter shield type bell you really need to weld in a mount for the nose and use a starter with the nose and spigot

sometimes it is this starter with a longer motor section to provide more torque i.e the long truck motor body and solenoid is used on the mopar passenger car snout
sometimes it is just the standard dakota starter with the body painted red and some go faster stripes.....


if it can start a 360 in can start a 383 400 or 440 provided you have not got 13:1 CR.

the only issues anyone should have with a starter for a morpar are if they have the following combinations

original street hemi cars used a direct drive 25mm 9 tooth pinion prestolite which based on the cars it was used on now commands $1000 in restored form... if you have one of them i know how to convert a 32mm pinion starter to 25mm pinion and make it work

aussie cars with 148 tooth flywheel use a 9 tooth 25 mm pinion or a 10 tooth 27 mm pinion on an offset nose.. you can't use a 27 mm pinion on a denso starter for this application without a custom offset...i tried it last weekend

aussie 340 360 torqueflite cars used the US 32mm 10 tooth pinion like US cars and US and Aussie starters interchange provided nobody swapped your car to the 148 tooth flywheel or fitted a v8 or hemi 6 with a slant six flywheel

US and Aussie ring gears

122 tooth ring gear Chrysler slant 6. Ring Gear 311.5OD 284.0ID 32mm pinion denso works

318 340 360 v8 with auto trans torqueflight 130 Tooth Ring Gear Chrysler 340 most 318-440 Auto Ring Gear 335.3OD 308.9ID 32mm pinion denso works

148 Tooth Ring Gear Description Chrysler Valiant australia Slant 6 1962-70, Hemi 6 215-245-265 some v8 1970-76 and Centura Ring Gear 317.5OD 293.3 ID use with 25mm 9 tooth or 27 mm 10 tooth pinion hemi engines produced until 82. custom pinion necessary to use the denso

some proper trucks. i.e real commercial vehicles used different mounting holes and pinion.

There will be combos that i have missed i can't say my ring gear notes/ pinion tooth notes are exhaustive


It is VERY easy to put in one of these starters and NOT seat the end of the nose in the hole in the bellhousing. The spigot is a tighter fit than the original and the hole is probably full of crap.

you then do it up and crack the front plate or chew the ring gear up. Its easy because the original was so fat and long, you could not get it so badly misaligned, and if you took out an original you had to take off the headers and hence you had lots of space.
You don't have to with a mini starter so you are already compromised space wise when trying to fit it.

The "jaws" of this starter are smaller and more intrusive than the original you need to get it round the ring gear and the D shaped spigot on the end of the nose seated properly in the o shaped spigot hole in the bell.
it will take more than 1 attempt to do this, and it goes in properly about 2 seconds before you lose your patients, and kick the thing down the garden. Your bellhousing seal plate, if fitted, will also make putting in the top bolt hard work as the snout of the starter has the same diameter right at the base as the original to position the seal plate but of course when you are putting in the top bolt the starter is not snugged up and the dimensions further up the snout are smaller so the seal plate is slightly over to one side blocking the thread of the bolt hole into the bellhousing


dodge dakoata starter images

https://www.google.com/search?q=dodge+d ... 80&bih=610

mopar mini starter images

https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C1GC ... CAc&uact=5

Mopar hi torque mini starter images

https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C1GC ... CAc&uact=5


mopar hi torque mini starter for 440 images

https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C1GC ... CAc&uact=5


looks the same to me.......

cheap unbranded remanufactured is what i have used.....£40 + £40 postage an import i dare say if you pressed one of these into use on a big v8 with high compression you might have an issue.... but then again you can just get another...

can't think a branded one is worth 4-6 times more money


WOSPerformance in the UK can sell you one, all nicely custom built for a jensen for $365 nice guys been talking to them to sort out my own starter issues and they provided a range of pinions so i could experiment.

or you can buy and unbranded rebuilt one for £40 off US ebay and get ron fenton to bring it in mine is green....no go faster stripe


dave
The Greater Knapweed near the Mugwort by the Buckthorn tree is dying
rogthedodge
Posts: 217
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 05 9:41 pm
Location: bexleyheath kent

Re: starter motor

Post by rogthedodge »

Thanx Dave for the in depth reply.It seems like all mod's.It's a "try it and see"
do it in a dodge
User avatar
Dave999
Posts: 9427
Joined: Thu Feb 24, 05 10:31 am
Location: Twickenham,London, England

Re: starter motor

Post by Dave999 »

yeah i'm 97.23456% sure the geezer on the TV tells no lie

rockauto dodge dakota section is the place to be

:thumbright:

Dave
The Greater Knapweed near the Mugwort by the Buckthorn tree is dying
68Roadrunner
Posts: 841
Joined: Fri Nov 11, 05 9:39 pm
Location: Halifax, west yorks

Re: starter motor

Post by 68Roadrunner »

I fitted the Dakota one to my 340 cuda, perfect fit.👍
Richard.
User avatar
Dave999
Posts: 9427
Joined: Thu Feb 24, 05 10:31 am
Location: Twickenham,London, England

Re: starter motor

Post by Dave999 »

and the only loss is the unique sound of a mopar old style reduction gear starter....everything else about it, i bet is better....

50 years younger and half the size with more torque and the same KW rating.....
and an OEM part tested the world over by people who drive dodge trucks....

you don't necessarily need to line the pockets of Mr Powermaster unless you have an exceedingly special application that warrants a nice big red starter.

an unassuming green one from NAPA Rockauto or JCwhitney works fine

Dave
The Greater Knapweed near the Mugwort by the Buckthorn tree is dying
Post Reply