Manual steering box rebuild

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Dave999
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Manual steering box rebuild

Post by Dave999 »

This is for RHD cars but the same stuff is used in LHD, you just don't need to do the ball-nut swap for a LHD case if you buy a LHD ball-nut and screw

you also won't need a different column shaft if you avoid Australian 16:1 box

The steering box consists of

Case (RHD Cast iron, chassis mount 1950s style, LHD aluminium alloy K frame mount)

Case top cover (Case specific, you need a RHD case top for a RHD case)

worm screw bearing pre load adjuster (fits LHD and RHD, just a threaded aluminium plug for the worm screw end of the box))

Hex shaped preload adjuster lock ring (All Mopar manual steering boxes and most Saginaw ford and GM)

Sector ( parts book code, standard steering parts-19-19-4. Shares same part number as US boxes but the R series 60,61 valiant uses 2072087 which is a 5 tooth sector) ,
S-VK (62-76), uses 2127104 or the superseded part 3643018 which was made until at least 2004)

Worm screw (AUS 20:1, US 16:1, US 20:1 ,or US 24:1 all the same with different part numbers due to ratio/thread size and handedness.
The AUS 16:1 worm screw is the anomaly (its shorter like a truck part)
All have the same thread orientation for use in mopar cars, in general truck parts screw the other way

Ballnut (matched to thread orientation and pitch)( needs to be put on worm screw the correct way for RHD or LHD)(Mopar Suggest that you are not competent enough to do this and the correct part should be purchased)

Sector bushes or needle rollers x3, suggest you use a steering box case that takes bearings which are Torrington 1812 or get an 1816 for the lower sector position) as of 2018 y-1812 nd y-1816 are obsolete b-1812 and b-1816 available on US amazon

As standard the box usually has 3 1812 imprial drawn cup needle roller bearings, one in the top cover and 2 for ths sectorshaft tunnel.
to make the box heavy duty you can use one or two 1816 bearings and one 1812 use the two longer 1816 bearings in the sector tunnel

worm screw caged ball bearings x2 standard Saginaw 525 seem to fit but ideally Chrysler part 2072060 or 2127097

or just put new hardened steel balls in the cages

Sector shaft seal Chicago Rawhide 11067 or equivalent

Input shaft seal National - Oil Seal NAT | Part # 7214

adjuster bolt and lock nut (standard US and AUS LHD RHD)

adjuster bolt shim to stop sector jumping in the case, 4 shims exist, you are supposed to choose the right one (its a fat washer, fits on adjuster bolt and fits with bolt head in slot in sector)

Ball bearings in your ballnut (don't loose them. 50% in one circuit 50% in the other and NONE in between 27 in each circuit)

Ball guides (guide the balls)

ball guide clip 2 screw or 1 screw clips exist


How to make a RHD 16:1 box using US Parts followed by general assembly
Avoid having to get an Australian 16:1/track/police steering column shaft or Pay for an Australian 16:1 box out of a race car or police car which has been rebuilt many times and is worn out. any hard chrome plaiting on the box interior parts indicates a shoddy rebuild

(based on ebay prices I think aussie 16:1 boxes are made of gold, $500-1k and the only other source is the 67 68 16:1 dodge dart box, I have never seen one anywhere)

1) get a 16:1 ballnut and screw from FirmFeel inc.

2) take off the ball guides

3) take out balls

4) swap ballnut end for end i.e put it on the other way round

5) grease ya balls

6) push 50% into one circuit and 50% in the other
push 21 balls into each circuit well greased
glue the other 6 into each ballguide with grease
press in ballguides making sure not to loose one of your balls the wrong way down the threads out of the circuit.
7) put on ball-guide clip

You don't need to do 1)-7) if just rebuilding a Left hand Drive steering box, this is just to convert a USA worm and ballnut to an Australian one

8)Put the case in a bucket and clean it
the old grease is waterproof and does not melt in boiling water.
You can burn it out with a torch but it stinks.
better to use brake cleaner to stop it clinging and Bananarama! out in lumps
9) prize out seals
10 Using your long extension and a socket that passes through the mid sector bearing Knock out the bottom bearing
11) use same method to knock out the top bearing from the other end
use a small screw driver style hex socket and small socket extension through the adjuster hole to bare on the inner lip of the cover bearing with rollers removed and tap it out
12) if new the grease on the bearings will be good, if shop soiled clean all new bearings in brake cleaner and gently blow dry, do not blow the needles out
13) use your sector to start the bottom and mid sector bearings into case. use a socket of similar diameter on your extension to knock them in fully
14) use wood block to put the cover bearing in

15) put worm screw adjuster seal in

16) mount the worm and ballnut in the case with a smear of grease
17) do up the adjuster plug to 20 inch lb
18) back it off so that it takes 3-5 in lb to turn the screw (one of the AF or Imperial sockets in your socket set fits the spline)
19) put in sector seal with Hylomar round the side and in the corner of the seal well in the case (knock it in with a block of wood)

20) pack worm screw and ballnut area with NLGI II red grease
this will move grease over into sector section as well when you move the ballnut
21) Put ballnut in middle of travel hold teeth parallel with sector teeth and insert sector
22) check that sector teeth and ballnut teeth mesh thus, middle tooth in middle slot
23) pump it full of grease and close it up
24) the adjuster button and shim need to be fitted into the sector slot and then the case top wound onto the adjuster stud

25) set it so that when you adjust the sector adjuster that it is stiff in the middle
Use service manual or Firmfeel 16:1 Mopar action article on firmfeel site for precise setting info.
26) centre the box using the master spline on the sector and the case casting seam
27) grind new master spline into wormscrew shaft.


once in car pump in as much grease as possible.

drive it to settle the grease and move the air about

top it off with 90 weight gear oil

With new everything, you have a brand new steering box. no slop, precise, rock steady on the move, and just damn good.



Sector

sector shaft teeth should be trapezoid in shape. look at pics below, see how bad my old sector was the teeth were so worn the trapezium shape was practically inverted

i.e looking from the side, wider at one end than the other. The teeth face is not parallel with shaft, wider teeth at top than bottom of teeth

looking from the front direct into the teeth wider at the top than the bottom. they should match similar contour to ballnut face.


worn teeth just mean you will have less adjustment from the adjuster, provided they clean up with a file they won't adversely effect the workings of the box unless so worn that you can not achieve stiffness in the middle of the box.

Dave
Attachments
rebuild kit from firmfeel  two 3/4 inch long and one 1 inch or so long drawn cup needle rollers
rebuild kit from firmfeel two 3/4 inch long and one 1 inch or so long drawn cup needle rollers
IMG_1744 (Mobile).JPG (34.36 KiB) Viewed 15507 times
steering box lid with old bearing still in place
steering box lid with old bearing still in place
IMG_1743 (Mobile).JPG (35.79 KiB) Viewed 15507 times
aussie parts:  Ballnut and screw the ball bearings for the screw the sector and the screw preload adjuster
aussie parts: Ballnut and screw the ball bearings for the screw the sector and the screw preload adjuster
IMG_1742 (Mobile).JPG (38.96 KiB) Viewed 15507 times
new 16:1 LHD ballnut and screw  to the left and old Aussie RHD ballnut and screw to the right. Notice the different orientation of the ballnut teeth.  1 way for left hand drive  the other way for RHD.
new 16:1 LHD ballnut and screw to the left and old Aussie RHD ballnut and screw to the right. Notice the different orientation of the ballnut teeth. 1 way for left hand drive the other way for RHD.
IMG_1741 (Mobile).JPG (38.32 KiB) Viewed 15507 times
Last edited by Dave999 on Thu Oct 06, 16 4:43 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Dave999
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Post by Dave999 »

more pics

ballnut swap round
Attachments
IMG_1762 (Mobile).JPG
IMG_1762 (Mobile).JPG (47.06 KiB) Viewed 15501 times
IMG_1759 (Mobile).JPG
IMG_1759 (Mobile).JPG (46.12 KiB) Viewed 15501 times
IMG_1756 (Mobile).JPG
IMG_1756 (Mobile).JPG (51.71 KiB) Viewed 15501 times
greasing your balls
greasing your balls
IMG_1755 (Mobile).JPG (50.51 KiB) Viewed 15501 times
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Dave999
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Post by Dave999 »

more
Attachments
Power sector: longer top , worn sector manual middle, new sector manual bottom
Power sector: longer top , worn sector manual middle, new sector manual bottom
IMG_1769 (Mobile).JPG (35.66 KiB) Viewed 15493 times
worn sector left  new sector right, look how worn the teeth are. this is what casues sloppy steering
worn sector left new sector right, look how worn the teeth are. this is what casues sloppy steering
IMG_1768 (Mobile).JPG (31.06 KiB) Viewed 15493 times
bashing in the bottom bearing GENTLY with the old sector
bashing in the bottom bearing GENTLY with the old sector
IMG_1765 (Mobile).JPG (44.52 KiB) Viewed 15493 times
sector mesh with Ballnut for RHD
sector mesh with Ballnut for RHD
IMG_1764 (Mobile).JPG (43.07 KiB) Viewed 15493 times
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Dave999
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Post by Dave999 »

more
Attachments
tapping in the top beraing
tapping in the top beraing
WP_20160503_003 (Mobile).jpg (73.74 KiB) Viewed 15491 times
IMG_1771 (Mobile).JPG
IMG_1771 (Mobile).JPG (51.36 KiB) Viewed 15489 times
top bearing in place
top bearing in place
WP_20160503_004 (Mobile).jpg (69.34 KiB) Viewed 15489 times
bottom bearing in
bottom bearing in
WP_20160503_002 (Mobile).jpg (69.66 KiB) Viewed 15489 times
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Dave999
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Post by Dave999 »

Job done
Attachments
IMG_1772 (Mobile).JPG
IMG_1772 (Mobile).JPG (50.02 KiB) Viewed 15486 times
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Post by Pete »

:read2: :read2: :read2:

:thumbright: :thumbright: :thumbright: :thumbright:
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Post by mopar_mark »

Excellent documentation, will make it easier for the next person.

Needs to be made into a Sticky thing :D :D
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Post by GJUK »

How much do you charge to do these Dave ;)
Brilliant.

Can we sticky this to a technical advice thread?
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Post by Pete »

"Sticky'ed" ;)

:thumbright: :thumbright: :thumbright:
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Dave999
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Re: Manual steering box rebuild

Post by Dave999 »

Just a quick note to update this

US ebay now seems to provide access to 16:1 and 20:1 brand new, Mexican or Brazillian made, US LHD steering boxes for about $200-$300

for US cars i think its worth it you could have 2 of these for the price of a firmfeel rebuild as they are similar in price, for a whole complete box, to buying the sector and wormscrew bearings 2 seals, a worm screw in your ratio and 2 tubes of waterproof grease once the Import and VAT is applied to each package.

if you have a RHD box in need of rebuild, i'd buy the US box in the ratio you need and swap the parts where necessary into a RHD box i.e the ballnut worm screw and bearings, doing the ballunt flip for RHD compatibility.

obviously not having done this i can't say 100% that the internals are identical, but finances dictate that a company making a new standard box for a very old car are not going to be reinventing the wheel. why pay costs to redesign, flameing river style, if you are not adding any new features

so i'd suspect they are genuinely a clone of the original the ballnut/ wormscrews and sectors are still made by Saginaw/Delphi so the detail for each application is in length, ratio (standard for all brands 16 20 24) and spline

i.e for RHD rebuild parts its worth the risk, its cheaper than NOS parts, it cheaper than firm feel if it doesn't work you can always put it back together and flog it to a ready audience of LHD owners.

you will need to buy a sector seal regardless. Rockauto sell them, but look them up on part number only, as the listings for manual steering for Mopar small sector manual boxes are wrong, you will end up with a seal with a coffee-mug diameter, it and the worm screw seal have been listed wrongly, since about 2006

Dave
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Stu Twin
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Re: Manual steering box rebuild

Post by Stu Twin »

I love your 'laboratory conditions'. Don't get too much moss mixed up with your grease.
:D
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Dave999
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Re: Manual steering box rebuild

Post by Dave999 »

needs must :) the workbench had been used for some cylinder head work, and had the drill press and bench grinder bolted to it, hence at the time the wall outside and a big cardboard lid seemed a much better bet. The garage was infected with loads of slightly magnetic iron dust and abrasive grit... i could never properly got rid of that mess.. i now do anything with a grinder or rotary tool outside.... lesson learned. when your screw drivers grow whiskers...deep clean is necessary.

I had to hose the whole place down and carefully Bananarama! up and bag it, when we moved. 15 years worth of dust and gunge and swarf that got away... the place was a health hazard, but you don't see it until you shift everything out, and i had collected a lot of stuff, i filled a 100 sq/ft unit with the stuff i kept.....! 40 odd boxes of USEFUL but completely useless, vaguely rusty stuff, all covered in dust.

steering boxes: compared to what you find inside when you take a broken one apart... that went back together spotless.. not as filthy as ancient diff or gearbox oil but a grotty job none the less, you have a vague whiff of the eau de saginaw for a few days afterwards


Dave
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Dave999
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Re: Manual steering box rebuild

Post by Dave999 »

what the Bananarama! is wrong with the word B-R-U-S-H ? :)

ah i miss that wall, great for working on bikes/scooters and lawn mowers. you could stand in the drive with them on the wall (at garden height),
machine at chest height, and no need to lift it.... i'm now downgraded to a black and Decker, which is never quite good enough. 21 inch cylinder mower on a black and decker is precarious and i wouldn't want to start it... mind lawn mowers got rationalised down to 1 in the move :) you only need 1.....seemingly, Webb mower or no mower i say...

Dave
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Dave999
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Re: Manual steering box rebuild

Post by Dave999 »

new source for 16:1 kit for manual boxes



Dave
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